BASEBALL COACHES UNPLUGGED
The Ultimate Baseball Coaching Podcast. Step inside the dugout with Baseball Coaches Unplugged, the must-listen podcast for players, coaches, and parents who want to unlock the secrets of baseball greatness. Hosted by Ken Carpenter, a 27-year coaching veteran, this show delivers exclusive insights from top athletes and coaches, revealing what separates champions from the rest.
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BASEBALL COACHES UNPLUGGED
What Can Chinese Taipei’s Batting Practice Teach American Teams?
When Coach Will Gorden stepped off the plane in China to lead a development program for Major League Baseball, he faced an immediate challenge: coaching 42 young baseball players who didn't speak English. This experience became the foundation for his transformative coaching journey that would span three countries and reshape his approach to leadership.
"More than anything, I learned a new way to communicate," Gorden explains on Baseball Coaches Unplugged. "After working with those kids who didn't speak the language, I can do anything with anybody in the United States." These international experiences—from witnessing the meticulous batting practice routines of Chinese Taipei's team to observing the profound reverence Japanese players showed toward the game—provided Gordon with a unique perspective few American coaches possess.
Now back at Rockhurst High School in Missouri after stints coaching in China, Taiwan, and India, Gorden has implemented a coaching philosophy built around what he calls "service-minded leadership." Rather than following the traditional model where freshmen handle equipment duties, Gorden places this responsibility on his seniors. "If you want to be seen as a leader, you're serving your teammates," he explains. This approach teaches players that leadership isn't about privilege—it's about service to others.
Gorden's candid reflections on his evolution as a coach reveal profound wisdom. Where he once believed "there weren't enough sprints that would cure everything," experience has taught him adaptability. "Kids change and I have to be willing to adapt to that mindset as well," he shares. This growth mindset extends to his approach with parents, where he welcomes hard conversations about playing time—a topic many coaches avoid.
Perhaps most refreshing is Gorden's perspective on youth baseball. When coaching his nine-year-old son's team, which didn't win a game all season, his measure of success was beautifully simple: "I asked them all individually...did you have fun? They said yeah. And do you want to play again? Yeah. Okay, that's it. Then we did our job." In today's hyper-competitive youth sports landscape, this commitment to joy and development over trophies offers a powerful reminder of what truly matters.
Ready to transform your coaching philosophy? Subscribe to Baseball Coaches Unplugged for more conversations with innovative coaches who are changing the game one player at a time.
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Hello and welcome to Baseball Coaches Unplugged, where I sit down with coaches from around the country and in this case, around the world and bring real stories and strategies from the best coaches and minds in the game. Today we're joined by a coach whose baseball journey has taken him from across state lines and across the globe, from coaching in Kansas and Missouri to leading MLB's development efforts in China. Coach Will Gordon brings a unique perspective to the dugout. Now back to where it all began, at Rockhurst High School. Coach Gordon shares his insights on building culture, international coaching lessons and what it takes to lead a successful high school program in today's game. To lead a successful high school program in today's game Rockhurst High School head coach Will Gordon. Next on Baseball Coaches Unplugged.
Speaker 2:Welcome to Baseball Coaches Unplugged with Coach Ken Carpenter, presented by AthleteOne. Baseball Coaches Unplugged is a podcast for baseball coaches, with 27 years of high school baseball coaching under his belt, here to bring you the inside scoop on all things baseball, from game-winning strategies and pitching secrets to hitting drills and defensive drills. We're covering it all. Whether you're a high school coach, college coach or just a baseball enthusiast, we'll dive into the tactics and techniques that make the difference on and off the field. Discover how to build a winning mentality. Inspire your players and get them truly bought into your game philosophy Plus. Get the latest insights on recruiting, coaching, leadership and crafting a team culture that champions productivity and success. Join Coach every week as he breaks down the game and shares incredible behind-the-scenes stories. Your competitive edge starts here, so check out the show weekly and hear from the best coaches in the game. On Baseball Coaches Unplugged.
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Speaker 1:Hello and welcome to Baseball Coaches Unplugged. I'm your host, coach Ken Carpenter, and wow do we have a very interesting guest for today's show and I really think you're going to enjoy the stories he shares about the differences between players in the US and the players that are playing the game in China. Got one simple ask If you enjoyed today's show, be sure to share it with a friend and, if you get a chance, leave us a review. It helps us to grow the show. Now let's get to our sit-down with Coach Will Gordon, rockhurst High School in Missouri. Thanks for taking time to be on Baseball Coaches Unplugged.
Speaker 3:Hey, always good to talk to another member of the coaching community and I've done it across various different aspects. I'm excited to get the opportunity to talk to you today.
Speaker 1:Well, you're back at Rockhurst High School and I guess I want to start off with you know how are you blending the culture and expectations of your past coaching experiences into this new chapter you have going at Rockhurst?
Speaker 3:Well, last year was my first year to be back at Rockhurst, after I had a short stint there for four years, as an assistant coach as well, prior to. So I feel like this is my second run, which is nice to know the lay of the land and also the times in between. Between 2011 and 2025. I spent 14 years kind of growing up, learning the game a lot more literally, went and coached around the world during that time and I've been I've coached in China, china and been the head coach of two other high schools on the state of Kansas in those times, but all of that kind of blends itself into what do we want to do as a unit, what do we want to do as a team? The school itself is Jesuit in its background, and so I feel like that gives us a strong foundation and culture that we can always kind of tie back into as well.
Speaker 3:It's a school that's seen a lot of success, especially in the football side. It's yet to win a state baseball title. It's had a couple of big leaguers roll through there as well, and one of the first things I'm doing is trying to tie back into those roots as to who was here. Why was this important. What are we doing and how can we move forward together as a unit? So I look back towards really the past and kind of you know what can we do and what lessons can we learn from those guys over here, why did it mean so much to them and how can we move forward using those lessons?
Speaker 1:Well, what drives your passion for coaching, both high school and you know your involvement with? I believe it's like a club level team there in Kansas City area.
Speaker 3:Yes, so I've been involved in various clubs and organizations. I currently am employed by Mackensites, which Mike McFarland and Kevin Seitzer started a while back, and I worked for Building Champions here in town for a long time. And I I I told my son the other day he's nine. I said, you know, I knew when I was 12 that I wanted to be a coach and just like any other coach, it has nothing to do with wins and losses, it has everything to do with relationships, the fact that I get the opportunity to go meet, and it surprises you every year, right, like you think, oh, this class is so special there's not going to be another one like it, and it's a different kind of special every time, and I think that's what A keeps me feeling so young and B really drives me to get the opportunity just to share and inevitably learn from them.
Speaker 3:That's how I feel like I really grow in. The game is. Each year I learn something more from a player than I do, probably imparting stuff on my own, so I truly appreciate the opportunity to go out there. That's my passion, is what can I learn from these young men? And then maybe, if I'm lucky, what can I have the opportunity to teach them, because it goes way beyond the lines too.
Speaker 1:Most coaches never get a chance to coach overseas and you mentioned earlier you know you've been to China with the MLB and what's the biggest lessons that you've brought back here to the US from that experience coaching overseas?
Speaker 3:You know, when you first get a job working for Major League Baseball, you have this expectation and this thought oh my gosh. You know, first paycheck says Major League Baseball and you're super excited. And we traveled 7,000 miles around the world. And, just like every other part of this game, you get humbled pretty quickly by the game. And you look at the facilities and, and it's just, you're living in china, um, and, and it's quite different, um, living in china for a lot of reasons, um, but one is I got 42 players. They're all ages 11 to 16 years old and none of them speak english. And, uh, my first, first day off there, I went for a little look, see, and they gave me a chance. I'm off the plane, uh, and it's less than 24 hours and my head boss tells me hey, I want you to go work with this young man on hitting. And I'm like, okay.
Speaker 3:So we walked down there and and it's dead silent. I mean, he, we're not going to have a conversation. We put a ball in the tee, we do front flips, I throw him some BP, we talk a little bit just by moving motions and things like that, and we communicated. And so you want to talk about what did I take back? More than anything was a new way to communicate. What I always tell guys you know me, with 42 guys that didn't speak the language together, I can do anything with anybody in the united states, we'll be just fine. Uh, we can communicate in terms of that.
Speaker 3:And then then the funny thing about the, the kid that I took down and go hit. We don't talk the entire time, we get done, we walk up and my boss says, well, how'd he do to the kid hitting? He was like perfect english. Oh, you know, he does pretty good. He knows exactly what he's talking about with hitting. And I was like you understood english the whole time, had had no idea, but my boss wanted to see what it was going to be like. You know, hey, go see, go see if you can teach this kid who doesn't know anything.
Speaker 3:Um, and so really the big thing I took back was how lucky we are here in the United States as well, how privileged we are when I see an 11-year-old kid who gets to see his parents once a week, once a year, excuse me and doing his own laundry, and our kid from Tibet who has literally showered twice a year for his whole 14 years growing up and I have to explain hey, bud, after showers we got to hit the showers after practice. It really makes you appreciate the game here. It makes you see a lot differently and I had some pretty cool moments over there too. But bringing that attitude every time back to the field when I watch those kids over there, the appreciation for the opportunity that they had is so amazing. And then to then hopefully translate that a little bit to our kids here in the United States at every level, you know this is, this is an opportunity each and every day to go out and do something that not everybody gets to, and don't take it for granted.
Speaker 1:Well, that, that is just mind boggling. I can't even for granted. Well that is just mind-boggling. I can't even imagine that. And you know, I was kind of wondering. You know the difference between the kid here in the US that's playing high school, he's on some elite travel team, and then you've got a kid, like you said, from Tibet. Those differences have to be huge, I guess, and it's maybe not so much the baseball side of it, but it's their lifestyle, I would think.
Speaker 3:Yeah, the kid from Tibet. You know, one of the unique things over there is we all kind of gave them American names, mainly because it's very difficult for me to yell Wong Wei Hao, which was one of my kids' names, where I can just call him Willie and that's easier. But the kid from Tibet, he chose the name Roger for Roger Clemens and he was this left-handed pitcher and he just won. For the first time ever, he pitches for Team China now they beat Chinese Taipei and he's the upwards of 90 miles an hour and this is a kid that, like I said when I tell you how to, I had to tell him how to take a shower, like hey, bud, you got to do this every day. The next day in my office, my secretary meets me and she's like hey, I need you to talk to Roger. Did he, did he not took a shower? Could you tell me? Needs to wear clothes to and from the shower, though he just had his towel and all his glory going back and forth and it was just.
Speaker 3:Yeah, so it was a trip, but you look at that kid and here's a 90 mile an hour arm at the. You know, beat chinese taipei and he's given an opportunity and, um, that's pretty much what all those kids are looking for. Right, there is just that unique opportunity that's there as well. So it was definitely an experience, for sure. I was in India for a week Major League Baseball Summit in India and with the mindset of, okay, what do cricket players? You know, you've seen Million Dollar Arm that was kind of the deal. There was only one field in all of India while we were there and we got to be on that field and there's some talented players over there. The game is definitely growing and it was just once again, this opportunity to do something that could give them another opportunity and it was really fun to see as well.
Speaker 1:Now, were there any other parts of the world that you had a chance to coach in, or were those the two main ones?
Speaker 3:So I coached in China, I coached in India and then I coached in Taiwan. I was the 14U coach for the Chinese national team in Taiwan for, like the Little League World Series, which I always thought like we came within one game of winning it, I thought it would be hilarious to return to the United States as the head coach of China and having their team there. But you know, you talk about experiences. To this day, chinese Taipei's batting practice was the most impressive thing I've ever seen in my entire life. They set up and they had all their hitters go through. In the first round they hit nothing but balls through the 4-3 hole and I mean on the ground through the 4-3 hole, one through nine every time. And then their second round, they went through the 5-6 hole and it was on the ground every single time. And the third round was right up the middle and they needed to hit that L screen, like that was their job. Oh, and before that it was 10 minutes of straight bunting and all that occurred there, and so it was unique to see that.
Speaker 3:And then in our championship game we had a kid who ended up pitching for the Brewers organization, starting for me, and I don't know where their kid ended up. I'm sure he ended up somewhere. We two 14 year olds so in 85, 86, with just bangers for days coming out of the hand, and I mean it was nothing, nothing through the fourth, two outs ground ball, right back to my kid, right down the right field line and the wheels came off of that bus rather quick. But we gave them a run for their money, um, and and all their coach could ask me afterwards was how do we teach our kids how to hit home runs? And I said I don't like. You guys can hit the ball wherever you want. That's best barrel control I've ever seen in my entire life. Um, don't worry about hitting the home runs. So it was, it was unique to see that perspective clean fielding, um, and just a, an incredible um reverence I want to say for the game.
Speaker 1:And they throw all the time. Would you say that the showmanship and the bat flipping and the 35 things in their back pocket and everything that's probably not happening a whole lot over there, I would guess.
Speaker 3:No, there's a Japanese school in shanghai that would come over and we were. The place where I was was three hours away, okay, and I would get to the ballpark at 7 am and those kids were there by 6 50 am waiting for me to unlock the gate to go to our school and the moms came with the bento boxes and they line up their helmets and they line up their bats and they ran in four groups of four in unison, around the track in lockstep, before my kids even came anywhere close to the yard. I mean, it was just a different thing. You know, you see Shohei today say something to the umpire, every at-bat commonplace, and and and to every player.
Speaker 3:That I was telling my kids. You know I always wondered why they take off their hat before they go into the field and they do it twice actually, and it's to thank the field for the opportunity to play on it and then afterwards it's to say thank you for the opportunity to have done this, and I just think that's such a unique way to go about looking at the game and and and it's a. It's a really cool thing to think about every time you step on a field, because you know we push the hustle in between the white lines.
Speaker 1:But, man, when you, when you take a moment and do that, um it's, it's pretty powerful message wow, I and I imagine now you're back here in the us and you can really tie everything that you've done there to help you build a consistent, winning program. And what is there like a certain blueprint that you've put together now that you've had this experience?
Speaker 3:You know, I don't know. I think younger versions of myself, you know, probably hammered in on the, I don't know. I was probably hammered in on the, I don't know, I was probably too rough and there's not enough sprints that we're going to cure everything right. And I think the most important thing I've learned along the way is kids change and I have to be willing to adapt to that mindset as well. My 9-year-old constantly reminds me of that too, and if I expect them to bend to me to every degree, it's not going to work. But what I want them to do is bend for each other, and I think that's the most important thing.
Speaker 3:When I look at continuity in a program year in and year out, the biggest thing that I try to stress is that seniors have to be service-minded leaders. That is their job to serve. If you want to be seen as a leader, you're serving your teammates. We have a rule in my programs that I've been in that the seniors are responsible for picking everything up and putting everything away, and they have the. They have the practice plan set up. They have everything put up. If there's a ball left out, they're the ones that answer to it.
Speaker 3:And I think I changed that mindset because I was so used to seeing it. Well, you're the freshman, you get the balls, you know, or you got to do this, you got to do that. And I thought that's not how this works. Like a, when you were a freshman, you didn't like you treated like that by senior and B. That's not how the real world works. Like you better learn to go serve. You, better be willing to pick up something for somebody else, and that's what's going to get you noticed and keep you around in whatever profession you're going to be in.
Speaker 1:You know you mentioned, you know early on coaching how you the sprints and different things. You know it kind of dulled a memory that I had one year early on when I was coaching. We came up as a team but we came up with the idea that for every run we give up. That's how many sprints we got to do after a game. And the guys just didn't like no player loves after a game to do sprints but it was amazing how motivated they were to not give up runs, especially the pitchers and you know you hate to say you know there's a punishment or however you want to look at it, for giving up runs, but they really took pride in not giving up runs and I think we ended up winning like 24 games that season and you know, know we had a nice season. So it's funny because how you can look back on how you used to coach and how you've adapted and changed over the years. Do you find yourself in that situation too?
Speaker 3:Oh yeah, all the time I can't. My players always tell me oh man, you've gotten so much easier, so much softer, and I like to remind them well, you guys just weren't very talented so I had to be hard. Talent, talent solves a lot of problems. Um, but at the same time you know one of my former guys I played college with he. He led the conference in hitting twice. He was my assistant coach this past year and my second year as head coach, and the first time I was head coach.
Speaker 3:He said are you still making guys run the mile? I said yeah, timed mile. Yeah, stop doing that. And I was like why? And he's like, where would I have finished in that mile? Every year? I said dead last. I said he goes. Did I ever finish last in the conference in hitting? No, you finished first. Right, yep, he goes. Okay, he goes. You can run the mile all you want, but look for those guys in the back and hit them three or four holes and see how he turns out. But I learned that you learn something each year and some years are. This was year one in a program for me and so did the seniors knock it out of the park with their service? Absolutely not. Did they do the best they could? Yes, is it a yes, um, and so I think, more than anything, over the years I've learned patience, um, and maybe, maybe, some grace, uh, whereas before I might not have had as much.
Speaker 1:So it's just a year-to-year thing well, what is something you believe in about coaching or player development that maybe most coaches might not agree with you on, or at least you know they might see it differently?
Speaker 3:Boy? That's a great question. I believe in having hard conversations. I really believe in those. I believe in absolute honesty between players and coaches and this might be a little controversial.
Speaker 3:I have no problem having those conversations with parents. You know, first and foremost, I tell parents I'm a parent, hey, I want to. I'm going to protect your kids, even from you sometimes. That's number one for me. I'm going to see them every day. We're going to go to work every day together. I'm going to love them. So they're my first priority. And I said we're going to learn to have hard conversations because that's what life's going to be about.
Speaker 3:And, let's face it, it's about one thing playing time. Right, I don't beat around that bush either. I know there's a lot of people say I won't want to talk about playing time. I've never had a conversation that wasn't about playing time uh, when it comes to a kid, and so my, I think maybe the biggest thing that takes people back is my willingness to go ahead.
Speaker 3:You want to have a good talk? Sure, let's go ahead, let's go sit down. You may not like what you have to hear, what I have to say, um, but this is what I believe in. I've never sat down once to write a lineup to screw a kid, um, and you and I might sit there and have difference of opinion, but I'm not one of those closed door guys. I'm not one of those. It's an open door program. You're more than welcome to come sit down and have that conversation with me, and we'll see where we are at the end of it and go from there. There'll be growth on all sides, because there's a lot of times where I don't know something or maybe I need to just listen, and maybe that's okay too something, or maybe I need to just listen and maybe that's okay too.
Speaker 1:Yes, I always made myself open to parents and you know, I think sometimes it probably drove my wife crazy because I take calls at night or whatever and things like that. But I figured it was best to have the conversation rather than letting it just brew. And you know, the biggest thing I always did was I was like give it at least 24 hours and maybe when you wake up in the morning you might feel a little differently. That's kind of what I would hope for. But you got to have those conversations because you know, everybody says parents are crazy. But you know, ultimately they they just love and care about their son and they want, they want to see them out there on the field. And that's a part of life, because once you get to out of high school and you go into the real world, it's it's mom and dad ain't going to be able to help you with that kind of stuff.
Speaker 3:But no, and I've to help you with that kind of stuff. No, and I found that having those conversations with the parents and the players like the more I've done that, the more I felt like I had more conversations with players, because they know and their parents know there's nothing. I'm not going to say one thing to one party and say something to the other at all. We're going to have the same conversation and I like it sometimes to have them both in there because I don't know which version is going to go home. So let's just make sure we clean it up and move from there. But I think the more straightforward and honest you be, like you said, the adversity is going to come at some time and you're going to have to hear hard truth and you're going to have to advocate for yourself and sometimes you're going to have to listen to somebody else say that you're not that way. Maybe that's the impetus they need to be a better player, better person, better parent, better worker later on, and I think that's important to instill early on.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and I always remind myself that anytime I had a conversation like that, to make sure you had make sure I had another coach with me, you had make sure I had another coach with me. And you know I had one coach. He always wanted to be there with me and he was a human resources director. So this guy was like he had his notepads, he had everything going, which you know. I appreciate it, because sometimes you forget what may have been said and you know he seemed like he always had it written down. So that's good. But when you're a're a coach, you got to really have somebody else in there just to make sure that things don't get twisted or out of hand.
Speaker 3:I guess you could say yeah, and I've invited athletic directors. I've my last times. I've had two young assistants last two years. One of them just took a head job this last year, had an outstanding year, and I have another one that's younger. It's actually a former player of mine that's now my assistant. It's a great opportunity for them. It's free practice for them. They don't have to own any of the decisions that are being made. I would say there's no better role than being a varsity assistant coach because Cause you get you don't have to handle some of those headaches and you get to just work and do one particular thing. So I try to include those guys as much for their growth as it is to protect a little bit of what could happen.
Speaker 1:Yes, and you know, I I think about that and I I had a former player of mine that was an assistant coach and and I had to go to a title IX meeting which I had never experienced before. So I took him with me and when we met with the attorneys, the attorneys asked me. They said, is this your attorney? And I'm like, no, that's Stegs, he's one of my assistant coaches. You know, it was interesting to go through that experience because they thought that we had all these extra things and we didn't, and they were like, okay, it makes sense now. But you had mentioned your son earlier and he's a young guy. I mean, he's a young guy and I guess, have you set goals for him when it comes to the game of baseball and how you want him to appreciate it and to be? You know someone who does it because it's something he wants to do.
Speaker 3:You know, I think my greatest fear early on was that I would push too hard or maybe be too honest with where I see him in the game. And so it's been a pleasant journey so far with him, watching him learn to fall in love with the game on his own. Hopefully, is what I'm always hoping. Do I push too hard sometimes? Yeah, on its own, hopefully is what I'm always hoping. Do I push too hard sometimes? Yeah, do I overreact sometimes? Sure, I'm not by far and away a perfect dad and I'm learning a lot about. I knew it was just an absolute wild ride, with throwing strikes and everything else that seems to come along with it. But you know, he's got baseball cards and I'm watching him at the Royals game the other day and he's sitting there and they're all showing each other cards and they're running down and trying to get him a jumbotron, and that's what it's about, you know.
Speaker 3:And I asked our 9U team. We didn't win a game this year. I think we tied like our first game. But I asked our 9U team we didn't win a game this year. I think we tied like our first game. But I asked them all individually. I pointed at each one at the end of the season and said did you have fun? They said yeah, and do you want to play again?
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 3:Okay, that's it. Then we did our job, we had fun, we got better, you understood more leaving than you did coming in and you want to play next year. And we all know we don't know what puberty looks like and we don't know when it's going to strike or hit or how, but it's been a very fun thing to watch him choose to be a catcher which, my God, I would never choose in a million years to have catchers. But you know what? You're constantly in the action. He didn't mind getting hit with the ball and, hey man, have had it right right through there.
Speaker 3:But uh, I will say the most unique thing I've experienced I've coached in state semifinals and playoff games in the extra innings and he, he can be up there in the first inning hitting and that feeling and that pit in my stomach is way bigger than it is any other time, any other place, and I just have to go through my head. Keep your mouth shut, just watch him. You know, make sure he swings fast, fast. But in his last at bat he punches out and like three straight pitches, like I think he swung the second one and um, I'm not saying anything, I go back to the dugout. I was like hey, bud, how'd you feel that bat felt powerful. Okay, there you go, bud. You felt powerful, punching out, looking. Okay, we'll work on that next season.
Speaker 1:So it's been fun, you know, and the great thing about what you said there and you know, for any listener out there that has a son playing, and regardless of what age level, you know, I'm assuming it wasn't travel baseball right- no, I mean, it's not.
Speaker 3:If we're traveling, I'm going to a beach and I'm not watching Little League baseball. That's not happening.
Speaker 1:Right. So you know, you see these crazy tournaments being played and teams traveling and they're being rated eight, you, nine, you and all these things and you know, at that age, like you said, the most important thing is at the end of it, did you have fun and do you want to do it again? Yeah, Did you have fun and do you want to do it again?
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's how it should be at that age. And you know, some of the stuff that I see going on, you know, because of X is just mind-boggling. It just blows my mind that coaches, I don't know, I guess they have a shrine in their garage or something where they hang up these plastic rings and banners and things like that, I guess. How do you feel about that?
Speaker 3:Well, I run youth programs. It's really interesting when you watch and you get to these guys. Usually dads quit coaching about 13 or 14. I have the same conversation with them at 13 or 14. If I could do it one more year, if I could do it one more time over again and it's never we would do more traveling. It's never more, it's it's the.
Speaker 3:The constant wish is to go back and develop or just be present. Just be present a little bit more and take away the need for winning. Because, let's face it, if you're doing a bracket, there's two words I hate more than anything. It's bracket play. Because I look at my own son's team. My God, if we won this nine-year tournament, we'd have to sit on a ball field and win three games on a Sunday after we won three other games. Like, what kid isn't going to want to go to the pool or go play Star Wars or whatever they're going to do, right? And that's what's going to kill it for them. It's not that they're not going to be any good, it's the fact that they set up a field for three freaking games in a row.
Speaker 3:And then I think about the other side, where and I don't think I've posted a highlight yet on my personal page of my son's baseball journey, a couple of pictures of him in gear or whatever, right, but it's odd to me and maybe I'm unique in that fact.
Speaker 3:But at the same time I really go back to the old school philosophy let's have fun, let's practice more than we play, and let's find a way to make each outing something that we can learn together. And then we set small goals within those right Like we're going to make sure that we're trying to be in the right spot for a double cut or the right spot for a cut. God knows, we ain't going to actually play catch in that, but we might be in the right spot to where somebody has, you know, and those are small wins. We execute a pickoff, okay, great, okay, and we're going to celebrate those small wins daily, which, I think, add up over time. But you're right, I think it's also not my place and if that's what your family chooses to do and that's what they choose to pride, all power to you.
Speaker 1:I just have a sneaking suspicion by the time you get done with it and you look back on the journey, maybe you'd approach it a little different. Well, can you share a moment, good or bad?
Speaker 3:that truly tested your leadership and how you navigated it. I tell you, though, one of the areas I'm most proud of myself as a coach is as there's a young man named Jack Jones, who played for me at shiny mission East for four years, and Jack's father passed away on a plane crash from. Jack was a young boy, 10, 11 years old, and I'll tell you this when I tell you we had a contentious relationship. You can ask any kid on that team if we would go at it, if I wouldn't lose my mind more, if he wouldn't lose his mind back. We're talking. He's a four-year varsity starter, sec committed senior year. Just talent like you wouldn't believe, but boy did we get after it sometimes Tore his hamstring, real bad Injury at the end of his sophomore season, I believe, and my proudest moment is he had an interview later on and he said I was like a dad-like figure to him, and that, to me, was that was what it was all about.
Speaker 3:We had this relationship on the field, we had this, and I didn't set out trying to do that by any means, but for him to say those words, that meant a lot to me. That meant the world to me of bad, tough, hard moments in that relationship where I had to call him and say, hey, man, I lost it today, you know, and and he had moments too where he had to do that and but baseball fostered that relationship and that was really important to me and it was one that I'm particularly proud of to this day well, I gotta hit you with the question I asked every guest hate losing or love winning?
Speaker 3:oh man, I think I know I would hate losing more than I love winning. Yes, I cannot stand it now. That being said, we did it 24 times this year, which was a new record for me in a season like we had a tough year. But you know, we had 10 one run losses and we out hit our opponents on the season. But boy, knowing those facts, I think are supposed to make me feel better, but they sure don't. If those 10-1 runs flipped in the other column, I can sit here and smile a little bit more. But no, I, absolutely I despise losing.
Speaker 1:Um, uh, yeah, for sure I to ask you this You're in that Kansas City area. Are you a Chiefs fan by chance?
Speaker 3:I enjoy the Chiefs. Yeah, we watch them here and there. Are you a Browns fan then?
Speaker 1:Yes, a little world opposite of the spectrum on that one, but yes, I am. Well, I'm going to hit you with a Chiefs question here. This is a little bit off topic of baseball, but who's more important, andy Reid or Patrick Mahomes?
Speaker 3:Man, that's tough, real tough on that. Because you know, here I am on the Andy Reid side of things and I know that I'm a lot better when I got a Patrick Holmes. You know it's a lot easier to be seen as a good coach with good players than it is to be a good coach with a losing record when that happens. So I got to say that probably the Patrick of my home is probably the secret, but at the same time you got to play the strings and the management of the clubhouse and all those things are probably good. But yeah, I've had some. I was always a lot better coach when I had a lot better talent. Let's put it that way.
Speaker 1:No doubt you know and that question also can be applied to the Tom Brady Bill Belichick situation which some people can look at it two different ways. But if you've got talent you're a little bit better coach every time, that's for sure All right, let's go with the Kansas City Royals.
Speaker 1:All right, let's hit with the Kansas City Royals right here. All right, let's go with the Kansas City Royals. All right, let's hit with the Kansas City Royals right here. You have two players today that you can take and put on your current Royals roster. Who would you take? Group A, you get George Brett and Zach Greinke. Or Group B and this is without injuries Bo Jackson and Brett Saberhagen.
Speaker 3:Oh man, that's a good question. I got to go with George and I got to go with Grinke. Just the overall consistency. Now, don't get me wrong, bo Jackson is the greatest athlete on the planet to probably ever live, in my opinion. I mean, it's just nobody's ever done anything with that. Guy has ever done uh, period. But for the longevity the jaw uh that george had and for the insanity of winning at cy young on a losing team was that grinky? You got to take that guy. I mean that guy's so beyond weird in the stories with him and flipping balls over and everything that he did. But he showed up and won a lot of games and those two guys besides seeing Brett and Bobby Witt Jr on the same side of the infield would be something else.
Speaker 1:Yes, definitely. You know they've had some good teams. They've had some great players. One of those guys I would love to talk to, george Brunson, on the podcast, but I think I would probably have a little bit more fun with Granke, because he's definitely got some craziness to him.
Speaker 3:I guess you could say I just think you'd have to wonder what questions he's going to ask you. That's where you'd have to be prepared for that.
Speaker 1:Well, I tell you what. Since you just threw that out there, let's finish on this one. You mentioned before we started recording that you've tried your hand at podcasting. What question would you ask me?
Speaker 3:What question would I ask you? Well, what is it? How do you get the consistency to do it weekly? I'm assuming you do it weekly, or is this biweekly or monthly? I apologize for not knowing. Yeah, weekly. So how do you get the energy and the planning and everything to do all that?
Speaker 1:Well, I found that I used to. When I started off, early on, I was doing it every two weeks and then I wanted to become more consistent with it. And then I wanted to become more consistent with it and you know it's. I set this goal of trying to, you know, interview a coach from every state in the country. And because early on I started out, I just basically had all of my coaching friends and people that I know here in Ohio. But now that I've expanded throughout the country and I think you know I've had like 35 states so far Canada, you know, and even got a Chinese coach now. So, you know, with you.
Speaker 1:But it's, it's one of those things. There are times when I say to myself I'm too tired, I don't want to do it, but then it's like there's nothing pushing me other than myself, almost like how teams say you're not competing against some opponent or the guys across the field, you're competing with yourself. And out of stubbornness, I just want to keep doing it. I want to keep trying to put something out every week. And it gets challenging at times because there's a lot of work that goes in it, because I'm a one-man operation. I research, I find the people, I do the research on them, I market it. I'm a one-man operation. I research, I find the people, I do the research on them, I market it. I have to edit it, I have to do it all and it also helps that you know, now that I'm, you know, in a state where I had to take disability retirement from coaching and teaching, I have a little more time.
Speaker 1:And it's fun because, well, you do a tremendous job, yeah, but I get to meet people like you, which you know, you know, 99 times out of a hundred I would never, ever meet you, probably in our lifetime. But now I get to walk away from this and you know I learned something and you know the first thing I'll do is I get to. You know my wife's going to say, all right, what was this guy like, you know, and so you know I go right back and I start rehashing everything that we did and it just means so much to me that you take the time to do this. But also, when I have people that I run into and they go oh my God, I listened to this guy, you know, and and the person who hooked me up and gave me your name, I just recently was in a parking lot and a coach came up to me and he goes.
Speaker 1:I was on a trip back from Florida and I just listened to that coach. You had on from Kansas. You know I really enjoyed that and thanks for what you're doing. And you know it's just something I do because it's fun and you know, maybe he got something out of that. So that's kind of why I do it and the long way of sharing it, but you know it's Well no.
Speaker 3:I appreciate it. I appreciate it. I'm going to tune in. I go on walks in the morning. I've been doing digging deep with Eric Hosmer. I enjoy that, so I'll be tuning into you. And then, now that I got your numbers, you got to watch out. It's a little dangerous. So I'll send you a few contacts on my phone. I got I got some good ones that you might want to reach out to and and see what those guys have to say. And then next spring I and see what those guys have to say. And then next spring I don't know what you're doing but hit me up again and maybe we'll put one of my players on and they can tell you a story of how mean I am and maybe we see how it looks from the player's perspective.
Speaker 1:Sounds good. Well, will, before we started, you said you had to take your young daughter to a dance lesson. So it's Will Gordon, Rockhurst High School Coach. Thanks a ton. That wraps up another episode of Baseball Coaches Unplugged. Huge thanks to Coach Will Gordon sharing his powerful journey from Rockhurst to China and back again. If you enjoyed today's conversation, make sure to subscribe, leave a review and share the episode with another coach who could use the inspiration. As always, I'm Coach Ken Carpenter. Thanks for listening to Baseball Coaches Unplugged.
Speaker 2:Thank you.
